Science of Self-Effacement

Question: If an ordinary person gets some Krishna-prasadam, does that mean he will take a human birth?

May not always be so. He may get a human birth after four or five births also. Anyhow, wherever he may go, some connection will be there in the universal mind. It is recorded in that plane, so it will not be lost.

Question: And if someone gives laksmi (donation) for Deity-seva or book printing?

This is sukriti (pious credit). Ajnata-sukriti (unconscious pious credit). After that comes jnata-sukriti (conscious pious credit), then sraddha (faith), then sadhu-sanga (pure association), then guru-karana (acceptance of a guru), then bhajana (spiritual practice), anartha-nivriti (removal of evil tendencies), ruchi (taste), asakti (attachment), bhava-bhakti (deep devotion), prema-bhakti (loving devotion), sneha (affection), mana (loving sulking), pranaya (love), bhava (ecstasy), maha-bhava (ultimate ecstasy). It happens in this way, gradually.

First is ajnata-sukriti: some energy is spent for Krishna consciousness unknowingly. This will be the very first foundation. Next, somewhat knowingly some contribution may come towards Krishna consciousness, which will raise me to the plane of sraddha (faith), when, on the surface, I shall start searching for Krishna consciousness people and mixing with them, helping them, taking their association. Next, I shall find a guru in Krishna consciousness. Then, I shall continue my bhajan under his guidance. Then, my anarthas will disappear and I will get proper attraction – real, pure attraction – for Krishna consciousness. I will go up gradually. These are the lowest stages to be traced, as outlined in the scriptures.

Question: Our movement sells millions of books all over the world, and sometimes people do not even know what these books are!

Those who purchase them get some sukriti.

Question: Is it ajnata-sukriti?

Yes, because their money goes to help Krishna consciousness.

Question: And if they take the book into their house?

Yes, even if they may not read it, their descendants may read it and become benefitted. Anyhow, the energy they spend on the books will help them.

Question: In Sri Bhakti-rasamrita-sindhu it is written that if you keep sastra in your house, it is like having the Deity of Narayana.

Of course.

Question: So, even if they do not know the value of the book, it brings some special benefit if they just have it in their house!

Yes, it will have its influence. It will emit a divine ray. If we have the eyes to see it, the mind may feel, 'There must be something holy here. Otherwise, why does my heart feel some holy ideas?' It may happen like that at a certain stage of consciousness.

Question: Maybe not in this life, but in some future life?

That depends upon the individual case.

Question: But it's never in vain. Our preaching goal is that every man, every human being will eat prasadam and take a book. Even if they do not know what they are eating or do not know what the book is about, we want to give prasadam and a book to every human being!

Good. You are trying to stealthily enter their hearts to establish a temple of Krishna there...

Question: We have now started businesses in America selling prasadam and every year MILLIONS of people are eating prasadam in America! And they do not know it is from the Hare Krishna movement!

It may give them some sukriti, but it must be a living thing. The more purity there is, the more purity will be transmitted to those who take that prasadam. Prasadam can be from a maha-bhagavata (the highest devotee), from a madhyam-bhagavata (a middle-level devotee) or from a kanistha-bhagavata (a neophyte devotee). It must do them some good in any way, but there is a question of degree.

Question: Krishna says in Bhagavad-gita that even a small amount of devotional service can save one from the greatest danger.

Yes, 'Svalpam apy asya dharmasya, trayate mahato bhayat' (Srimad Bhagavad-gita, 2.40). That is the verse.

Question: So, can ajnata-sukrti counteract all sinful activity? For example, if somebody makes a little donation or takes a book, is it sufficient for that?

This can only help me to begin my life. However small, it should be taken as admission.

Question: But does such ajnata-sukriti qualify for 'trayate mahato bhayat'?

It may, but it will take time to save you from 'mahato bhayat'.

Question: Suppose there was no ajnata. Then, due to their sinful activities, a jiva soul will have to take so many births in degraded species of life, and it will be a very long time before they get another human body. Will this ajnata-sukriti speed up the coming of their next human body?

It may take a very, very long time. Also, there is an opposing tendency towards divinity, which is aparadha, vaisnav-aparadha. It is very troublesome. Other crimes or offences can be removed very easily, but if the crime has to do with divinity directly – if one commits vaisnav-aparadha, dham-aparadha, and so on – then it is a little difficult matter. For example, Jagai and Madhai were great sinners, but within a moment all their sins vanished, and it is remarked that it was very easy to deliver them because they had never committed vaisnava-aparadha.

Question: We believe that if we can give a jiva soul a book, then very soon they will get another human birth because Krishna says that whatever service you have done it is permanent. So, if one gets a book in this life, they should be able to get a book in their next life, too!

Maybe. If one has got a little touch and feels, 'I have got a book, so I must read it and see what is written in it,' then this sort of tendency may take them to a human birth again.

Question: We are selling books with the faith that this will save people from their karma.

...There is also another way of looking at it. It is our master who is preaching Krishna consciousness, and we are only helping him in one way or another. I may not sell books, but I may cook or sweep the floor. My contribution will be to help my master who is doing the preaching, who is spreading Krishna consciousness. I shall partake of that. Suppose there is a big mill or a big factory. At the end of the year, they calculate all profit and loss, and if the factory has made a profit, then even a sweeper that works there gets benefit. Whatever your duty may be, everything from head to bottom is adjusted in this way.

So, whatever we do, if we are conscious that we are doing the service of our gurudev, that we are working under him, supplying whatever is necessary (bringing water, cooking, doing gardening, and so on), then everyone's combined effort will product some result, and our remuneration will be allotted to us according to our sincerity and capacity.

Question: But my concern is how to help the jiva soul become free from all their karma, sinful reactions. So, I have been preaching that if we sell books, it will help free jiva souls from their sinful reactions.

This is 'Krsna karmarpana' (offering your actions to Krishna). It depends. Your progress will depend on the extent to which you are consciously doing your duty to satisfy your guru, Vaishnavs and Krishna. The degree and intensity of your earnestness, hankering and thirst to satisfy them will determine your progress and improvement.

Question: But what about non-devotees? Non-devotees have so much sinful reaction. So, if we sell them books...

Whatever the case may be, the criterion is always satisfaction of Krishna (the Lord) or kasna (the Lord's devotee). The benefit will be distributed according to their satisfaction. Supplying a glass of water can fetch a greater gain when it is supplied at the time of need. So, the benefit we get depends on the intensity of the earnestness with which we come to satisfy our Lord and the degree of His satisfaction.

Question: When our Prabhupada heard that there was a massive distribution of books, he said that it pleased him the most, that it would give him life! So, it pleased him very much.

If you do it with this idea, then you will have great justification. You may feel in your heart, 'Guru Maharaj is satisfied with the way I discharge this duty.'

Question: How can I engage the people I am preaching to in Krishna consciousness?

I know that Srila A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Maharaj used to give everyone tulasi-malas (chanting beads, rosaries) to be counted on. He introduced this, but neither our Guru Maharaj nor all the other gurus did that, so I also do not like to do that. It will be an offence to the tulasi-mala. Such people should practise informally: read books, listen, consolidate their faith in Krishna consciousness, and when they are fully prepared, they can receive an established connection with Tulasi beads. Not any other way.

Tulasi should be dealt with respectfully. We were very much astonished to see that in the West there is no distinction between high and low, pure and impure. So, sometimes we hear that tulasi-mala is put on a shoe! It is horrible for us to see this or even think of. The upper part of the body is considered pure, and the lower part is considered impure. We can deal with holy things only with our hands, not with our foot, what to speak of a shoe! Respect should be maintained, and we should know how to show respect. If you touch anything with your foot, it is disrespectful. Trampling on Tulasi or touching Tulasi with your shoe or your leg is very offensive. It is written so in the scriptures, and we also feel this.

When your consciousness is raised a little, you should know better. For example, a baby can put his leg on the lap of his mother or kick his mother, but a grown-up boy cannot do that. So, ignorant people may deal with Tulasi and Deities in an ignorant way, in any way they choose, but those who have grown up in Krishna consciousness should know better. As you grow in Krishna consciousness, you learn what to respect and what to disrespect. Such knowledge must come. We are to kick offences and revere service. Such differentiation and distinction should be maintained.

Question: So, should people then chant or do kirtan like that?

One can start chanting the Holy Name after getting it from gurudev.

Question: But prior to that, what should their daily activities be like?

They may take the Name without beads.

Question: If they take the Name without the beads, is it not perhaps that they will be irregular?

It may be irregular, but physical regularity has no value. One can chant day and night without getting a tinge of progress. Not only that, one can even go down by chanting.

কোটি জন্ম যদি করে শ্রবণ কীর্ত্তন ।
তবু না পায় ব্রজেন্দ্রনন্দন ॥

koti janma yadi kare sravana kirtana
tabu na paya vrajendranandan

'Even if you practise hearing and chanting for millions of lives, you will not get Krishna, the Son of King of Vraja.'

You can go on taking the Name for crores of births, but if there is nama-aparadha then you will have to go down despite your chanting. It is necessary to know how to chant. So, first there must be sravan (listening).

The first stage (sravan-dasa) is to only listen attentively and learn what is what. Then, the second stage (varan-dasa) is to accept what you hear with a serious mood and determination. At this stage you come to accept and surrender to a guru and you receive connection with your gurudev (you get the spiritual seed, chimaya-bija, from him). After that, the regular devotional life begins. This is the third stage (sadhan-dasa): the stage when proper practising life (sadhana) begins – after getting initiation from gurudev. Before that, everything is fictitious, similar to rehearsal or a mock fight. The fourth stage (apana-dasa) is when you can feel that this is your home. Finally, the fifth stage (prapan-dasa) is when you try to give it to others.

This serious gradation and regulation are there. It is not to be played around with. We must be serious in our spiritual conduct.

Question: So, if somebody listens and becomes attracted...

One must be attracted to a particular standard, after that they receive connection with the guru, and only after that they may get a mala.

Question: But in the meantime, as they listen, can they do anything else like offering bhoga?

They may offer bhoga in a general way, with the Name, and take that, but this is all an initial grade, a preparatory activity, not a regular life. A regular life begins only after getting direct favour from gurudev, after getting connection with the spirit.

Question: How should they offer bhoga? Usually they just have a simple altar with pictures...

Try to save yourself first. Make yourself busy with how to be delivered yourself. Do not be so eager to uplift others. Save yourself first, then you will know what to do. Otherwise, what you do may become a trade for the sake of name and fame, and then your life will be spoilt. It is said, 'Janma sarthaka kari' kara para-upakara (জন্ম সার্থক করি' কর পর-উপকার). Take advantage of this birth by bringing benefit to others' (Sri Chaitanya-charitamrita, 1.9.41). But first know thyself, then try to advise others. Give importance to your own self, know it yourself first, come to a stable position, then think about others. Otherwise, it will be a trade-like thing for you. Half-knowledge and half-truth are more dangerous than falsehood.

There was one gentleman, a disciple of Srila Swami Maharaj, who came to me. He only wanted to write books in many languages. He wanted to write a comparative study of religions and print many books. I told him that first he should know things himself, then he can try to write books. He stayed here for a few weeks, and he was determined to write many books comparing Christianity, Vaishnavism, the Madhva school, this, that. I told him, 'Physician cure thyself. First know what the truth is, then go to distribute it to others.' Otherwise, in the name of distribution you will distribute poison. First know what is nectar, then distribute it. Half-truth is more dangerous than falsehood. You must know it first yourself; after that, when you get some internal inspiration, then, yes, you may distribute it, you may try.

Question: So, right now what should I do? What should my activities be like?

Mind your own practices. Become an example, then you will impress them, and when they come, you can say, 'Sarva-dharman parityajya (সর্ব্বধর্ম্মান্ পরিত্যজ্য). Give up all kinds of religion' (Srimad Bhagavad-gita, 18.66), you can tell them about Krishna, you can call them 'back to God, back to home.' You can begin preaching in this way.

But do not distribute beads; do not turn it into a farce. When they take japa-mala, it must be serious. When they seriously come in connection with a proper guru, then this sort of thing should be done, otherwise it will be misused, and a bad atmosphere will be created. Doing anything and everything, eating anything and everything, and counting beads – not like that. If you only count the beads without any real faith, without pure practices, it will be disservice.

Quality, not quantity. Try to understand and acquire it, and then preach it. First quality must come. Mere physical imitation is not a real thing. It should be soul's food. They should read. Give them books. They should listen to lectures and try to understand things. There should be eagerness created in their hearts, 'Yes, I want this! This is the only way how I can do service to my own self and to people at large.' Such confident conviction should be created. Otherwise, only to increase the numbers physically has no value because in the near future some reaction will come and devastate the whole thing. Slow but sure. The progress may be slow, but the progress must be sure. It is so in propagation, in realisation, in every aspect of life. Slow but sure wins the race.

Do you understand what I am saying? It is not a very cheap thing. Among one crore people, you will hardly find one. 'Kotisv api maha-mune (কোটিষ্বপি মহামুনে). Among millions of liberated and perfected beings, it is extremely rare to find a self-satisfied devotee (devoid of material desires and filled with happiness coming from their pure self) who worships Lord Narayan' (Srimad Bhagavatam 6.14.5). It is of the highest quality, so, generally, very few are to be found in such a higher section. This is not ordinary consciousness. Krishna consciousness means eliminating all sorts of other God consciousnesses whatsoever.

So, please try to educate them, and educate yourself. Dive deep into the study of the scriptures, realise it yourself, then you will speak from that plane. When ordinary people come, say to them, 'Try to read, try to know what Krishna consciousness is, try to know it. It is not one of many. It is not one of many religions like Christianity, Islam or Judaism. Try to study the special characteristic of this line.' Preach about Krishna consciousness in this way, let them realise what it is, and then formal acceptance will come. Otherwise, it will be a farce. Do not create any farce in the name of Krishna consciousness.

Krishna consciousness must be given the highest regard. It holds an exclusive position; it is not one among many. It is THE best. Why is it THE best? This is the kind of preaching that should go on.

Question: You see, initially, what I have been doing was holding services. We chanted some kirtan, did some arati and distributed prasad...

Everything should be done with much consideration. Prasad distribution! They may commit offence against prasadam. If they disregard it, then it will be an offence. There is a possibility of offence in any activity, so we must do everything carefully.

Consciously or unconsciously, their energy should be utilised for the highest cause. After that, when they listen and come to share some regard for it, the question of acceptance of a mala and a formal life arises. Then, with the help of sadhus, they will increase their realisation and go farther up. It is not a trade.

Question: When we honour prasad, should we appreciate how Krishna has tasted it?

We should try to be attentive towards the conscious side of prasad, avoiding the material side. All our sense experience (eye experience, and so on) should be utilised for that purpose – it will be subservient to God consciousness, connected with God. 'Oh, it has a nice color. It has a nice scent. It is soft to touch.' All this is not meant to satisfy us! We must realise that it has satisfied the Lord. We must transfer the centre from our own egos to the Lord. All our feelings should be subservient to the Lord, to His satisfaction. This is the main thing. Harmonise everything with the higher plane. Be conscious that the enjoyer is He, everything is for Him. Krsnendriya tarpan (satisfy Krishna's senses), Krsna-santosh (satisfy Krishna).

We must appreciate how He has been satisfied with the color, with the scent, with the softness, with the dressing, and so on. Everything must go in that direction. We shall see whether He is satisfied and try to follow His satisfaction. Everything should be thought out not in a primary way but in a secondary way – how He has tasted it, how He has liked it. My liking will be subordinate to His liking. There must be no separate, independent liking. Everything must be in submission to His taste, His satisfaction.

We shall seek this in every aspect of life, not only when it comes to prasadam. In every way of life, we shall try to connect everything with Him: how He is satisfied. Our inquisitiveness will always be, 'Does this satisfy Him?' His satisfaction should be searched in every action.

Because He is far away, we should look to the next nearest centre: the guru, the Vaishnav. If they are satisfied, then it is alright, then it is guaranteed that Krishna is satisfied. If my guru is satisfied with my service, then I may take it that Krishna is satisfied – otherwise, the guru will not show his satisfaction. In this way, we can take it to the nearest station. If the guru is absent, then we can direct our attention to any devotee who we can safely think to be superior to us. If such a devotee is satisfied, then I shall try to be satisfied, too. In this way, we shall seek the satisfaction of the supreme will in every activity. Whatever I do, will it satisfy Krishna, my gurudev or a Vaishnav? If it does, then I shall do it. Do not rely on your own self. When none is present, then we can ask our guru, Vaishnavs or Krishna within ourselves, 'Are you satisfied? Will you be satisfied?' We must inquire within us, 'Gurudev, I am in this dilemma. Which side should I take? Please dictate me.' We should try to stand before our guru with a clear, unbiased mind, and if we feel any suggestion coming, we shall do that. Nothing more may be expected from us in our position.

We shall always try to be faithful to the conception centred around the guru, Vaishnav, Krishna, Mahaprabhu, and so on. Our way is mainly self-effacement and self-surrender.

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